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Post by Hey Man on Apr 17, 2015 22:56:55 GMT -5
Apparently Doc Magee is taking down KISS videos that showcase Paul's horrible vocals.
Here is another version not yet taken down.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 0:39:36 GMT -5
I love the band and Paul - and I think he hit his best stride since 2010/2011 with 2014 live vocally...but he's at another low point and this has got to be addressed. Either do a final album, rest, tour then retire - or get retirement for KISS rolling now.
If you're having to do damage control on your lead vocalist, it's not smart to keep limping into the future as is.
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Post by B5Erik on Apr 18, 2015 0:40:47 GMT -5
Clearly this has been an issue within the organization, but they've done a good job of keeping their internal discussions private.
It says a lot that they're taking this step. In a way it's an acknowledgement that there is a problem and they don't want people to focus on it. They're now trying to hide it, but the genie is out of the bottle. The cat is out of the bag. The metaphors all fit.
I've been saying for 3 years now that KISS needs to just do one more album with an outside producer and then call it quits after a brief final tour (one NOT billed as a, "Farewell Tour"). Last year's tour was a huge improvement over the last few years and it would be a shame for the band to go out with Paul sounding even worse than he does now.
I love the band, but this has gone beyond ridiculous. If Paul still had even his voice from 2009 they could fake their way through the live shows, but he doesn't. His voice now makes his 2009 voice sound good. It's time to let it go.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2015 1:01:52 GMT -5
Clearly this has been an issue within the organization, but they've done a good job of keeping their internal discussions private. It says a lot that they're taking this step. In a way it's an acknowledgement that there is a problem and they don't want people to focus on it. They're now trying to hide it, but the genie is out of the bottle. The cat is out of the bag. The metaphors all fit. I've been saying for 3 years now that KISS needs to just do one more album with an outside producer and then call it quits after a brief final tour (one NOT billed as a, "Farewell Tour"). Last year's tour was a huge improvement over the last few years and it would be a shame for the band to go out with Paul sounding even worse than he does now. All of this. |
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Post by Hey Man on Apr 18, 2015 1:11:24 GMT -5
Clearly this has been an issue within the organization, but they've done a good job of keeping their internal discussions private. It says a lot that they're taking this step. In a way it's an acknowledgement that there is a problem and they don't want people to focus on it. They're now trying to hide it, but the genie is out of the bottle. The cat is out of the bag. The metaphors all fit. I've been saying for 3 years now that KISS needs to just do one more album with an outside producer and then call it quits after a brief final tour (one NOT billed as a, "Farewell Tour"). Last year's tour was a huge improvement over the last few years and it would be a shame for the band to go out with Paul sounding even worse than he does now. I love the band, but this has gone beyond ridiculous. If Paul still had even his voice from 2009 they could fake their way through the live shows, but he doesn't. His voice now makes his 2009 voice sound good. It's time to let it go. Unfortunately Paul is in denial and I just don't think he would allow anyone else to produce - he is unwilling to be taken out of his comfort zone. |
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Post by B5Erik on Apr 18, 2015 1:18:56 GMT -5
Clearly this has been an issue within the organization, but they've done a good job of keeping their internal discussions private. It says a lot that they're taking this step. In a way it's an acknowledgement that there is a problem and they don't want people to focus on it. They're now trying to hide it, but the genie is out of the bottle. The cat is out of the bag. The metaphors all fit. I've been saying for 3 years now that KISS needs to just do one more album with an outside producer and then call it quits after a brief final tour (one NOT billed as a, "Farewell Tour"). Last year's tour was a huge improvement over the last few years and it would be a shame for the band to go out with Paul sounding even worse than he does now. I love the band, but this has gone beyond ridiculous. If Paul still had even his voice from 2009 they could fake their way through the live shows, but he doesn't. His voice now makes his 2009 voice sound good. It's time to let it go. Unfortunately Paul is in denial and I just don't think he would allow anyone else to produce - he is unwilling to be taken out of his comfort zone. I don't think Paul is in denial, really. He knows how bad he sounds. I just think he is terrified of the prospect of a life without being, "Paul Stanley of KISS!" I don't think he knows how to deal with that. That's been his entire adult life. Who is he if he isn't in KISS? I don't think he knows or even has any idea. His insecurities and his need for the love and adoration from the fans is a huge part of what keeps KISS going. But as Monster didn't go over as well with the fans as they would have liked I think Gene and Doc can pull a power play and tell Paul that he's had his turn as Producer and now it's time for someone else to do it. Gene can easily threaten to walk away (and do a project with Bruce and Eric - Gene Simmons' Revenge), so that would leave Paul with nothing. If it's work with an outside producer or face the end of KISS I think Paul would be pragmatic enough to know that in order to feed his ego and that need for adoration that he would have to agree to an outside producer. |
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Post by Hey Man on Apr 18, 2015 1:21:56 GMT -5
Unfortunately Paul is in denial and I just don't think he would allow anyone else to produce - he is unwilling to be taken out of his comfort zone. I don't think Paul is in denial, really. He knows how bad he sounds. I just think he is terrified of the prospect of a life without being, "Paul Stanley of KISS!" I don't think he knows how to deal with that. That's been his entire adult life. Who is he if he isn't in KISS? I don't think he knows or even has any idea. His insecurities and his need for the love and adoration from the fans is a huge part of what keeps KISS going. But as Monster didn't go over as well with the fans as they would have liked I think Gene and Doc can pull a power play and tell Paul that he's had his turn as Producer and now it's time for someone else to do it. Gene can easily threaten to walk away (and do a project with Bruce and Eric - Gene Simmons' Revenge), so that would leave Paul with nothing. If it's work with an outside producer or face the end of KISS I think Paul would be pragmatic enough to know that in order to feed his ego and that need for adoration that he would have to agree to an outside producer. But if he isn't in denial - why would he allow his voiced to be strained by doing those acoustic shows meet and greets where Gene tells him to save his voice. |
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Post by B5Erik on Apr 18, 2015 1:28:34 GMT -5
I don't think Paul is in denial, really. He knows how bad he sounds. I just think he is terrified of the prospect of a life without being, "Paul Stanley of KISS!" I don't think he knows how to deal with that. That's been his entire adult life. Who is he if he isn't in KISS? I don't think he knows or even has any idea. His insecurities and his need for the love and adoration from the fans is a huge part of what keeps KISS going. But as Monster didn't go over as well with the fans as they would have liked I think Gene and Doc can pull a power play and tell Paul that he's had his turn as Producer and now it's time for someone else to do it. Gene can easily threaten to walk away (and do a project with Bruce and Eric - Gene Simmons' Revenge), so that would leave Paul with nothing. If it's work with an outside producer or face the end of KISS I think Paul would be pragmatic enough to know that in order to feed his ego and that need for adoration that he would have to agree to an outside producer. But if he isn't in denial - why would he allow his voiced to be strained by doing those acoustic shows meet and greets where Gene tells him to save his voice. Because he needs the adoration of the fans, even if it's a smaller group. Hell, in those smaller groups he can actually hear what they have to say (and it's always nice). I don't know - it's almost like there are two Pauls at the same time. One desperately needs the love and adoration and believes that he's, "Good enough to get the job done," while the other is embarrassed by how bad he sounds (and you can see it sometimes in his facial expressions when he struggles to get notes out and only gets something out that sounds like he's strangling a cat - he looks embarrassed and disgusted). He's got issues. His childhood really screwed him up big time. |
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Post by Justlee on Apr 18, 2015 2:13:22 GMT -5
Time to ride off into the sunset. No shame in retirement. Paul has nothing to prove. I would say he has had a successful run.
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Post by DWF on Apr 18, 2015 7:26:03 GMT -5
I love the band and Paul - and I think he hit his best stride since 2010/2011 with 2014 live vocally...but he's at another low point and this has got to be addressed. Either do a final album, rest, tour then retire - or get retirement for KISS rolling now. That's true. He was so comfortable at the handful of sound checks and shows we caught last summer. Seemed very at ease and a bit stronger than the last 4-5 years. (He was also making frequent trips to his vocal doc in NY.) Seems downtime starts the whole process over and the damage done becomes a little bit tougher to deal with each tour. It's a shame. |
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