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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 14:39:52 GMT -5
So I was reading a comment from Necro on the FAQ about KISS and marketing costs:
Can someone please tell me where the money would come from for KISS to market this thing like Van Halen and have enough sales to recoup a net profit.
The answer is Paul and Gene's pocket, which would have zero impact on their financial bottom line even if the album tanks. But if they believe in the album and want to give it the best chance of success, they need to put their money where their mouth is, assuming that they don't have a distributor and deliver on a campaign as impressive as Van Halen's. They could afford it easily and like I said, it would be money that they wouldn't miss if Monster tanks. It would be chump change to them.
This wouldn't be the first time someone puts in their own money to market an album and certainly movie studios and music companies spend over a billion dollars just in marketing every single year and take a bath on most of it. But they continue to do it, because they have to if they want to promote their product to the world and have it be potentially successful.
Gene and Paul are cheap - we all know this, but I am surprised more people don't come out and say that Paul and Gene need to write some checks if they want to be competitive and give their album the best chance of success. Even if the difference is between 300,000 and going gold, it would be worth it especially considering that Paul and Gene have money to burn so to speak.
I would like to get Necro's response to this, so if someone wants to post this on the KISS vs. Van Halen marketing thread, I am cool with that.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2012 15:01:28 GMT -5
The response would be, and it's a valid if out dated one for Gene and Paul one, is that they've never done it that way before. They're old school in their thinking and I don't think anyone , at this point, is going to change their minds.
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 15:03:31 GMT -5
The response would be, and it's a valid if out dated one for Gene and Paul one, is that they've never done it that way before. They're old school in their thinking and I don't think anyone , at this point, is going to change their minds. Then they deserve to fail and have no one to blame but themselves if Monster underperforms. You change or you die. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2012 15:07:37 GMT -5
The response would be, and it's a valid if out dated one for Gene and Paul one, is that they've never done it that way before. They're old school in their thinking and I don't think anyone , at this point, is going to change their minds. Then they deserve to fail and have no one to blame but themselves if Monster underperforms. You change or you die. I wouldn't say they deserve failure, but, of course, not promoting the album the right way for todays public is going to lead to lesser sales. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 15:11:41 GMT -5
The fact remains, if Paul and Gene had any faith in the album, and their audience, they'd be willing to do what it takes to get the thing in people's hands. If they're too afraid to put up their own cash to promote then they obviously don't believe in it and it's just another excuse to go out and do yet another greatest hits tour. 100% Fact. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2012 15:23:24 GMT -5
The fact remains, if Paul and Gene had any faith in the album, and their audience, they'd be willing to do what it takes to get the thing in people's hands. If they're too afraid to put up their own cash to promote then they obviously don't believe in it and it's just another excuse to go out and do yet another greatest hits tour. 100% Fact. But they've never put up their own money for any album. They've never believed in any album they've made? |
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Post by Anomacunt the Excellent on Feb 2, 2012 15:24:46 GMT -5
But they've never put up their own money for any album. They've never believed in any album they've made? They never released a record truly on their own until Monster, so we'll have to wait and see. All other records were either released by a label or by a retailer. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 15:26:23 GMT -5
But they've never put up their own money for any album. They've never believed in any album they've made? But times have changed - they didn't need to put in their own money, because they were a signed band and someone else was always footing the bill. They need to adapt to the times today if they want any type of success. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2012 15:33:59 GMT -5
Well, we don't know yet how this album is being relaeased or who will be behind it. Of course, if they're doing it solely on their own, they'll have to use their own money. However, I doubt any personal finances will be used. Whatever is floating in teh Kiss Organisation is what will be used.
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 15:40:15 GMT -5
If I was Gene or Paul, I personally would want to be as competitive as possible, so if I am looking at how Van Halen is being marketed or how Aerosmith will end up being marketed, I would be embarrassed to not deliver the same thing when I could afford to do so without even thinking about it.
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Post by dute on Feb 2, 2012 16:59:58 GMT -5
Then they deserve to fail and have no one to blame but themselves if Monster underperforms. You change or you die. Agreed. |
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Post by Justlee on Feb 2, 2012 17:03:21 GMT -5
If I was Gene or Paul, I personally would want to be as competitive as possible, so if I am looking at how Van Halen is being marketed or how Aerosmith will end up being marketed, I would be embarrassed to not deliver the same thing when I could afford to do so without even thinking about it. The marketing campaign behind Van Halen is massive and expensive and costs Van Halen nothing...no way Paul and Gene are going to match what Interscope is dropping on Van Halen. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 17:08:54 GMT -5
If I was Gene or Paul, I personally would want to be as competitive as possible, so if I am looking at how Van Halen is being marketed or how Aerosmith will end up being marketed, I would be embarrassed to not deliver the same thing when I could afford to do so without even thinking about it. The marketing campaign behind Van Halen is massive and expensive and costs Van Halen nothing...no way Paul and Gene are going to match what Interscope is dropping on Van Halen. Give a ballpark figure on how much you think Interscope has spent on marketing Van Halen. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 19:55:17 GMT -5
Then they deserve to fail and have no one to blame but themselves if Monster underperforms. Obviously, some people would enjoy that. Well they had a fantastic run - but it's now time to close up shop. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 21:46:47 GMT -5
Well they had a fantastic run - but it's now time to close up shop. Why? Because some people don't like their band anymore? I've never understood why any band should shut up shop because some people don't like what they do anymore. It's their band and their livelihood. If some people don't like what they do now, why don't they just ignore it? As people in entertainment, we are allowed to critique them. It's not like they are going to listen to me. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 22:05:18 GMT -5
As people in entertainment, we are allowed to critique them. It's not like they are going to listen to me. You and I both know it goes a lot further that a simple 'critique' of the band. A good example of this is thekissarmy.com, which insists current day Kiss is irrelevant and a joke....yet a look at their forum sees 99.9% of their posts about the current lineup. Almost all of them are jokes or attacks on the band and/it's members. A miniscule amount of time is spent on the Kiss they supposedly love. Now I have no issue with those who don't like the band anymore, but to suggest what goes on around some Kiss forums as 'critique' is naive, at best. I personally see nothing wrong with internet attacks of rock stars, movie stars, movies, celebrities, sports stars, etc. - it gives people an outlet to give their opinion and for some, it's entertaining to read. For me, I found people being critical of KISS to be far more interesting to read over people loving them on the FAQ. |
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Post by dute on Feb 2, 2012 22:13:51 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with discussing a band negatively or negative aspects.
It's the broken record feeling about it.
On.
And on.
And on....
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 22:16:08 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with discussing a band negatively or negative aspects. It's the broken record feeling about it. On. And on. And on.... Well if you continue to suck, people will continue to point that out.  |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 22:29:54 GMT -5
I personally see nothing wrong with internet attacks of rock stars, movie stars, movies, celebrities, sports stars, etc. - it gives people an outlet to give their opinion and for some, it's entertaining to read. For me, I found people being critical of KISS to be far more interesting to read over people loving them on the FAQ. Like when ATL was critical of this forum and you asked if he doesn't like it why doesn't he go elsewhere? One has absolutely nothing to do with the other. If ATL is going to convey that he is not happy here, then a common question would be - why do you stay here or in his case, why don't you go to the forums he mentioned that think as he does. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 22:47:56 GMT -5
One has absolutely nothing to do with the other. I agree. However, the concept of not moving on from something you don't like is the same, which was very obviously my point. If ATL is going to convey that he is not happy here, then a common question would be - why are you still here or in his case, why don't you go to the forums he mentioned that also don't like the gays. Again, I agree. However, ask someone who no longer likes Kissfaq why are they still there and why don't they go to forums of people who think the same, they tend to get defensive and very a little upset. Sorry, I don't buy into the notion of moving on, because you may not like something - especially if you are still overall a fan. I am a KISS fan, even though I don't like what they are presently doing and I want to give my opinion about them. It's like Star Wars fans that trash the prequels. Well maybe they feel they have a right to be there just as much as anyone and their opinion is just as valid, even if it's deemed to be a negative one by the masses when it comes to KISS. I have seen people attack Anomaly, because they don't like him talking about Van Halen and have told him to go to a Van Halen board. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 22:56:35 GMT -5
Well maybe they feel they have a right to be there just as much as anyone and their opinion is just as valid, even if it's deemed to be a negative one by the masses when it comes to KISS. I have seen people attack Anomaly, because they don't like him talking about Van Halen and have told him to go to a Van Halen board. So have I. Anyone has a right to be there, just like ATL has here or on any public forum, but let's not kid each other as to why some like to go there though. It's for attention. Sorry, I don't buy into the notion of moving on, because you may not like something - especially if you are still overall a fan. I am a KISS fan, even though I don't like what they are presently doing and I want to give my opinion about them. It's like Star Wars fans that trash the prequels. Don't kid yourself - EVERYBODY goes there for attention. Julian started the forum for attention. I started this one for attention. Everybody on the internet is looking for attention in some way or another. |
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Post by dute on Feb 2, 2012 22:58:03 GMT -5
Julian started the forum for attention. You maybe don't think he started that forum because he...you know...likes talking about KISS and random stuff? |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 23:01:01 GMT -5
Julian started the forum for attention. You maybe don't think he started that forum because he...you know...likes talking about KISS and random stuff? Of course, but he wants an audience to read it. If no one came to his site, he would have given up long ago. Internet sites/forums are not unlike TV shows - you want ratings. |
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Post by dute on Feb 2, 2012 23:01:55 GMT -5
Most sites on the internet are established to gather an audience. Everyone's guilty. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 2, 2012 23:02:27 GMT -5
Most sites on the internet are established to gather an audience. Everyone's guilty. Tis true. We are all whores. |
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Post by Justlee on Feb 3, 2012 9:05:37 GMT -5
The marketing campaign behind Van Halen is massive and expensive and costs Van Halen nothing...no way Paul and Gene are going to match what Interscope is dropping on Van Halen. Give a ballpark figure on how much you think Interscope has spent on marketing Van Halen. Hard to say. But I did hear that Interscope was indeed betting the farm on this release. |
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Post by Hey Man on Feb 3, 2012 9:27:40 GMT -5
Give a ballpark figure on how much you think Interscope has spent on marketing Van Halen. Hard to say. But I did hear that Interscope was indeed betting the farm on this release. Could Paul and Gene cut a check for 5 or 10 million dollars without feeling it? Yep. |
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Post by Justlee on Feb 3, 2012 9:48:32 GMT -5
Hard to say. But I did hear that Interscope was indeed betting the farm on this release. Could Paul and Gene cut a check for 5 or 10 million dollars without feeling it? Yep. I am sure they could, but they aren't going to do that. I do think Interscope will drop more than 5 to 10 million on this thing. |
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Post by Justin on Feb 3, 2012 17:51:25 GMT -5
No better marketing than word of mouth and it's cheap too. Really do i want KISS to be successfull because of some marketing campaign to all the sheep out their. Any success KISS have is real success, it's not just brought by a marketing campaign. I don't want KISS to be a dime a dozen rock band that buy there success. I like KISS to be a little under groundy. And would part of good marketing include a music video ? Maybe they could bribe / pay off all the radio disc jockeys and have success  Todays success means little in my eyes. Has Van Halen's new album got a music video ?? |
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Post by Justin on Feb 3, 2012 17:53:24 GMT -5
Hard to say. But I did hear that Interscope was indeed betting the farm on this release. Could Paul and Gene cut a check for 5 or 10 million dollars without feeling it? Yep. So what give Just lee's band 5 or ten million and anybody can be successfull. come on man that's not real success. |
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